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Allan Burch
Posts:61
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| 10/16/2007 6:18 PM |
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New homepage:
I'm guessing it's ready for critique, otherwise it wouldn't be live.
Visually, it looks better. The hierarchy is more evident. I like seeing a mission statement right away. I like having the site map in one place.
I also understand this portal is more than a portfolio site. It's equally geared to provide resources for the artist and tools for client-collaboration.
Having said this, I must say I'm a bit disappointed in a few things. When I reviewed this new home page as a rough draft last week, I was hoping to see a smarter, more intuitive, confident navigational pathway from point A (entering the site) to point B (landing on a specific artist's profile). I really believe it can be done and done in a very elegant way. When I reviewed the home draft, at least there was an (somewhat cumbersome and too vague) "Advanced Search" button below the finder field. As I'm looking at the home page now, it's been removed, making a clumsy search feature even more repellant for visitors. In my opinion, this is not only missing an opportunity, but committing a cardinal sin if a goal is to respect the visitor's time, help guide them where they want to go, and make them want to return. I don't think I'm alone when I believe a search feature on a portal like this should give a visitor great control in finding exactly what they want (search by discipline, article, blog, member, project, etc.). A find feature that makes him or her guess and travel 4 clicks when a more elegant portal will get you there in 2, is a major detriment. Featured artists, showcase, most discussed, most viewed, and the other categories listed are great for secondary browsing. Primary browsing will be "I want to find an artist" and "I want to find a project." I think one of Jamuse's priorities should be to eliminate as many potential hassles for the visitor as possible. Navigation, above all, should be an incredibly high priority. I know Bruce is very conscientious of others' time. I guess I'd like to see a little more of that infused to his, and our, portal.
Here's an example from a hypothetical, 50% of the time, potential target user:
I want to find Joe Illustrator. I click to the home page. My only goal at this moment will be to find Joe Illustrator. I look to the menu. People like to see things already done for them. So, I look for a menu item that looks like "find an illustrator." Featured Artists...too broad, don't know. Expert...is that an artist? New members...wouldn't know. Most discussed, killed, viewed....too broad, don't think so, but could be, not likely, though. Ok, how about the Find. Looks pretty broad and uninviting. I sure hope it doesn't pull up all irrelevant results with the keyword "illustrator." I'm just looking for Joe "2-dimensional" Illustrator. Darn it! it pulled up all irrelevant results with the keyword illustrator. At least there's some kind of advanced search feature that will allow me to.......whaa? No advanced search?! The videos and everything are great, but I really only have time to find this one 2D illustrator. There's only a few hundred registered Jamusers, I guess I can scroll through them all to find exactly what I want. Fortunately on October 16, 2007, there are only 16 projects keyed to the word illustrator. What about on October 16, 2008? What about the 20 other great creative portals that will give me what I want in a way much more respectful of my precision-oriented workflow? Jam files are phenomenal, but they better be second only to the worldwide web itself to make me overlook the holes in your navigation. Signed, Joe Target Jamuser.
Secondly, I'm a big fan of consistency. The menu at the top is not consistent with the menu on the right. Inconsistency breeds confusion. Priority 2, in my view, should be eliminate confusion.
When I click from "Home" to "Community," there is nothing that tells me I'm on the "Community" page. I realize the html title is "Community" and one can simply look to the top of their browser and see this. I would ask how many other great sites don't give visitors a clue within the page where they are? I'd sure like to see the page I'm on highlighted in the menu, as a gentle reminder of where I'm at.
Are the icons in the "Welcome to jamuse" window supposed to be active? They aren't, currently.
There are some great features here, but they're in danger of being overshadowed by an inconsistent and cumbersome navigation.
I have a few comments about the portfolio images, which I'll post a bit later.
As always, if this home page is still a work in progress, and these issues are being addressed, then my apologies for re-stating them.
If possible, I wouldn't mind learning more from the Jamuse decision-makers about their philosophy on the site's navigation. What do you envision it to be? Does the current setup meet your expectations? Perhaps I'm also missing the point of this site.
Thanks for the opportunity to comment.
Allan
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john Bolt
Posts:2
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| 10/16/2007 7:38 PM |
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Overall.... I LOVE the new site
design. Much more intuitive and easy to navigate.
I also liked how showroom
was broken out. Looks like a few more areas to explore. Good job
guys:) |
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_sobule design
Posts:41
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| 10/16/2007 7:45 PM |
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Good points, Allan.
I *think* that the Jamusers are still trying to figure out what the priorities are in terms of menu-hierarchy and so on. I think (hope) the nav will become more streamlined (less clicks) once things are prioritised. Is it a priority for people to get to the portfolios in the least clicks possible? I'd personally think so, but it's also a priority to show community-related content and the museworx functionality. I'll note that currently there's a LOT of video/commercial categories on the nav but this reflects that there's a lot of said content on the site so it makes sense from that angle.
Feels WAY more like a homepage now, that's for sure. Gives a sense of depth in terms of the amount of places/nodes available.
One comment about the menu, and I believe this has been mentioned elsewhere, is that it should be persistent throughout the site. Sometimes it's there, sometimes it disappears completely (like on the COMMUNITY>CONTESTS page) and other times it terms into a flickr-esque list of other keywords (as in SHOWROOM>MOST DISCUSSED). However, once in PORTFOLIO or PROFILE mode the right-menu becomes a little more stable but still has a tendency towards the inconsistent. As mentioned before some of the inherent confusion may be the various and inconsistent naming conventions in use; Portfolio, showroom, etc. Maybe there's a way to streamline that?
I completely understand that the menu-system needs to be contextual based on where in the site one is but maybe there's a way to help anchor people in the site. Maybe a breadcrumb nav somewhere to indicate to users where they are? Maybe some consistent element at the top of the nav that expand or contract based on context? I'm just brainstorming at this point.....
Perhaps the menu should move to the LEFT of the content-areas. This is the standard paradigm and it's what we as westerners are used to see online. I hate to split hairs but I think even a small thing like that could help the site feel more rooted to its nav-system. The first time I looked at the site I automatically 'blocked-out' the right-menu because I initially discounted it as ad-space. After a second glance I realised it was navigational.
Seems to me a lot of confusion is coming from three main areas:
1) Overall site purpose (a tricky one because of its multi-purpose, multi-faceted nature)
2) Navigational ambiguity
3) Naming ambiguity
f Thoughts, anyone? Any other Alexes wanna chime in on the matter? ;)
thanks,
aleks.
[passes soap-box to the next poster....] |
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David Fritsche, Founder
Posts:239
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| 10/16/2007 8:52 PM |
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Wow, a lot of text here...I thought we were artists...where's the picture worth a 1000 of them?
Not looking for a soap box...I hope none of you are as well. Just looking for opinions on making things better for you...and the respect to know that we will implement, according to priority, that which applies to all.
Allan, seems like many are related to things in other posts that we will be implementing in later releases. Such as the advanced search that will be exactly what you are looking for ....
Some of your comments are the items designers have discussed with search engine designers from other major sites. Google, etc... the real question was to have search be more like Google - keyword driven or more like what Yahoo used to be - category driven. The answer was both. The priority was to keep it simple with keyword searches - as this is the trend in search, but to also provide categorization and advanced search for two separate areas: 1. The artist 2. The work Most seem to think this area works brilliantly and is in need of categories. We agree.
It will get better...with your help... When the site in NOT a work in progress, we'll all go home...meaning - it will always get better. The Navigation is not complete throughout the site yet...give it a couple days.
I'll take exception with the other Alex:
>>Seems to me a lot of confusion is coming from three main areas:
1) Overall site purpose (a tricky one because of its multi-purpose, multi-faceted nature) - Community for professionas priving a better way - see the new home page.
2) Navigational ambiguity - getting better and loving it.
3) Naming ambiguity - what? you do not like toast? |
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Allan Burch
Posts:61
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| 10/16/2007 10:13 PM |
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David,
Thanks for the insight and the response. It's good to know these things are in the works.
Allan |
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Director Fox
Posts:48
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| 10/16/2007 10:20 PM |
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First of all, thanks for posting my kudos on the front page. My wife got a kick out of that ... Probably because she knows that if somebody acts as though they're listening to me, I'll never shut up! So, not to disappoint, here are some initial thoughts:
1) I think the introductory animations are really funny. But, with that kind of humor, and the new "Jamuse is ..." paragraph (which clearly targets creative professionals), are you running the risk of alienating our potential clients? If I went to a site that made fun of creatives, with quotes like "I'm going to have to charge you extra for that," and "It's still rendering, so I'm going for a smoke break," I don't think I'd feel very welcomed.
_______
2) Allan has great points, and I agree 100%. As an example, I tried to find myself.
In the "find" box on the front page, I typed in "Alex." Predictably, I got several dozen (29) responses. Assuming, for the sake of illustration (as Allan points out, eventually the site will have many more users) that I was not on the first page, I clicked on "photography" in the the "filter users by category" menu that had appeared. Oops ... Now the results are up to 93, even though "Alex" is still written in the "find" box. That's not a filter, that's a whole new search! Going back to square one, I type in "Alex, photography" in the "find" box. I get 42 results. I figure that "photographer" would be the same, but just for fun I try it. I get, inexplicably, 39 results. At this point, simulating a potential client, I gave up.
____
3) David, in response to your point about Google vs. Yahoo, I think that people looking for creative talent are much more likely to be searching by category - or, more accurately, "discipline" - than by keyword. Simple interfaces may be the trend for search engines, but this type of site demands specificity. Typing "hernia repair" or "midget porn" into Google is probably going to get you the results you want, but Jamusers aren't looking for general information/content, they're looking for people. So, for example, if I'm a client looking for help on a design-heavy grocery store ad, am I going to search for people with "grocery" in their portfolio first, or am I going to look for graphic designers first, and possibly want to narrow them down by grocery experience second?
Since you're working on an advanced search function, I would suggest that the hierarchy be as follows:
1) Discipline (drop-down menu that corresponds to the rest of the site)
2) Location (this should probably be in the form of "[x] miles from zip code [xxxxx]"
3) Keyword (analogous to the present "find" box)
______
4) This is more of a programming nit-pick than a functionality issue, but I notice that most of the descriptive content on the home page is either Flash or a graphic. A quick glance at your source code didn't turn up any "alt" text either (although I did see a huge and ponderous series of nested tables). This means that everything that describes Jamuse is invisible not only to search engines, but also screen-reading and other accessibility software. I highly suggest applying some CSS to this patient, stat! I'm sure some of the designers on here who do web work will be able to weigh in on this topic with expertise as well.
____
Anyway, David, it's great to see you and your team actively responding to our feedback. The process is clearly working, so let's keep the ball rolling! |
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Director Fox
Posts:48
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| 10/16/2007 10:23 PM |
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| I made a mistake in #2 above ... When I type "Alex, photography" in the "find" box, I only get 14 responses, but as the actual word "photography" does not appear in my profile blurb (although it is my category), I am not among them. |
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Director Fox
Posts:48
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| 10/16/2007 10:26 PM |
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| By the way, why is the "edit your post" function disabled in this discussion, but not the others?
EDIT: This has now been fixed, and the subscription option (to receive forum posts via email) has been replaced as well. Thanks, guys! |
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Allan Burch
Posts:61
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| 10/16/2007 11:17 PM |
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I agree 100% with Alex. Point #3 is perfectly stated and I would ask that this be in the forefront of the site designers' engineers' minds.
I think it's great that we have the expertise of Google engineers at our disposal. Like Alex states, this site demands specificity. So, as the navigation continues to improve, if Jamuse can harness the power of a Google search engine *and* tailor it to the needs of the creative professional, it would be a much smarter way for artists and clients to effectively find what they are looking for.
For what it's worth, I had similar thoughts about the opening animations. |
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harroyo
Posts:9
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| 10/17/2007 1:40 AM |
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wow...i like the new navigation and the new info on the site. I did not know the info on the site and do not know that there is anything else out there that addresses my needs as a agency art director. I'm starting to train my workers on the site and getting each to create a portfolio and make recomendation on procedures for the firm. In short, it is good to see someone with so much talent in technology dedicated to our needs.
Not sure on the suggestions you made above. I am sure things can be better and glad to see the site change so quickly. I worked at Ogilvy for 8 years and our IT would take 6 months to implement a change. Some of the things suggested seem trivial from my perspective, but then again, I am not looking to be found, just love the idea of managing assets and transferring files as well as getting consistent feedback/approvals from clients...can't tell you the problems this may solve...
On the home page, we look for creatives to fill certain needs based on client demands. We learned not to try and own all the creative ideas and talent years ago. It seems the industry is leaning this way and I heard a stat that up to 60% of my former agencies are doing the same. BTW, I did some checking and heard from my boss at my former employer that the people who started jamuse are well connected to the top levels of my former employer (chairman and ceo, etc)...the point being that I would use the site to find people when it is open and I assume that they will as well.
Rumors aside, I think the home page clued me in a little and I will be asking for my own new features...including
1. an advanced search.
2. clarification of security - a big concern for our clients
3. maybe a certification program so I know artists I find can be trusted and have been vetted somewhat.
4. A way to share assets amoung my workers. |
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Director Fox
Posts:48
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| 10/17/2007 7:37 AM |
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Hector,
Great to hear a client perspective! I'm curious about a couple of issues, from your point of view:
1) I love the idea of a certification/recommendation feature. Any ideas on what that might look like?
2) Did you find the tone of the site welcoming, and the introductory animations amusing? Do you think other agency folks might be less than amused, or is it a non-issue?
3) I have also heard that, post-9/11, agencies have been very slow to hire, preferring to use a lot of freelancers. From your perspective, how does the freelancer selection process work? Would you actually hire somebody from a website like Jamuse, and if so (or not) what would you be looking for? (And how could Jamuse make it easy for you?) |
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_sobule design
Posts:41
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| 10/17/2007 9:57 AM |
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Hector — thanks for speaking up! More experienced views the better for everyone.
My worry with certification would be that there then would be a need for a body/group/panel that monitors the certification... Maybe an field in the profile for member-organisations; AIGA, etc? Or a screening process (maybe there already is one?) for placing one's portfolio online? A community-juried set-up? Could be interesting.
I work both with my own boutique-studio, and on special projects, as the creative lead with a large agency for which we bring in a lot of freelance help. I can't speak for the 'States but that's certainly the trend here in Canada, specifically Toronto, to bring in lots of freelancers. Most of the large firms and agencies here use a talent-recruitment/staffing agency that pre-screens all of their talent. Large firms are willing and able to pay this premium.... however for my own studio-projects when we need freelance help (which is becoming more frequent lately) it's through word-of-mouth almost exclusively. We've tried craigslist but the CL-community is so active that literally hundreds of responses come almost as soon as something's posted — which would be fine if they were really quality responses.... This is why I'm excited about Jamuse; it's both a place to post one's own profile but also a place to find freelancers, or better yet full-on collaborators for bigger projects! Very cool. Very promising.
thanks,
aleks.
*edit* David, I like toast as much as the next guy.... Just not on my projects ;) Things are getting clearer by the day and I think it's as much (and I can only speak for myself) myself taking in the breadth of possibility in terms of what can be done using Jamuse. The Jam files are going to be great!! |
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Constance Rose
Posts:10
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| 10/17/2007 1:52 PM |
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Here are a few ideas:
A place for us to put client testimonials
ability to easily switch around the order of thumbnails so we can rotate those first four images
Just a few thoughts...
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harroyo
Posts:9
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| 10/18/2007 1:18 AM |
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Alex/Aleks, X/K
1. Certification ideas - have not thought about how this might work, just that I appreciate the need. Here's a little on-the-fly thoughts:
I know what K means about placing an ad for help and wading through junk. Of course there are employment agencies, talent scouts, etc...very expensive and that is the value they bring...to weed through the yard. I do not think jamuse intends to be an employment agency, nor do I think they should weed out anyone who thinks they are creative. It should be open to all. BUT, maybe there can be a vetting committee to certify certain things as kind of a first pass -
A. Real person
B. Real work
C. Real references
D. Real reliable
These people would not necessarily be better than anyone else, but they could be "jamuse approved", which would help. I suppose such a thing on a volunteer basis might not work...time consuming and not real interesting, which would mean that jamuse would have to staff it and probably need to charge a fee for the service. Even dating services cost hundreds...but it makes the match better.
2. Introductory Annimations- I missed the ones your mentioned. The one in the ad on the front page were fine. We experience all these sharing files issues. who doesn't. Unlike some, we have staff to help, but I bet the business management would pay to replace that staff with reliable technology en una momento. The tone is for creatives and I get that. We are both a creative department and creative seekers. I find the other sites out there as lame and mi abuelo's burro (yes he did have several). What I really mean is boring and not creative. Hold the attention of the creative person and provide for their needs, then i will show you a place I will look for talent. Also, my rumors seem to go past my previous employer as to the reach of the key people.
3. X - post 911, K yes, they are all trending to work more with freelancers. I think there are articles on this, but with globalization and google, staffing internally everytime you get a 100 million dollar contract is only great for the 2 years they hold the contract. Too many downsides. We've all been there if you've been around for more than a few years.
K, full-on collaborators for bigger projects? Meaning work, or dd you have something specific in mind?
H. |
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n/er/g communications
Posts:24
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| 10/18/2007 2:17 AM |
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Wow. All of the A's are on fire!
I'm sure it will make some of you happy to hear that all of my concerns with the new page have already been addressed. As a result this will be short and sweet.
1. Kudo's for addressing Jamuses purpose front and center. I think upon arrival, assuming you read it, it will help you be more understanding and tolerant of what's going on.
To assist along these lines i would also suggest simply dropping in the word "beta" and corresponding version number (ie. 1.0, 2.4, etc) right next to all the logo's. While some will say this is trivial, the more savvy end user will instantly identify that this site is a "work in progress" and again will be more apt to cut it some slack functionality wise. I see it also helping us quickly realize if the site has been updated recently (due to the version number being increased) or not.
2. I second the motion for implementing some CSS. Not only would it help solve the consistency piece many have mentioned, it will surely make you developers lives much easier when making simple changes.
3. I think one of the biggest assets jamuse has right now is the diversity of creatives and corresponding disciplines. This is also one of the biggest challenges.
Obviously, we all have different plans for how we'll eventually use the site. So rather than try and create a creative community panacea all at once, would it make sense to address the development by discipline as it pertains to the vision? I see this as a way to drill down to the core and build it upwards and outwards from that point. I also think it would allow you address each disciplines specific needs one at a time while not alienating the other requests that may not rank high on your priority list.
At the very least, i would recommend setting up separate forums for each discipline to address requests/enhancements. You may very find this would also eliminate duplication of suggestions in posts.
While we can see that you are listening, it would be unrealistic for us to expect that you add or enhance each one of our requests, as they are requested Especially if there is an internal game plan we may be unaware of. I know from my perspective, i would much rather speak up at the right time instead of potentially feeling as though i am repeating myself.
4. Also, from a functionality and user experience perspective, you may want to consider using AJAX in some pieces of the site. Initially what comes to mind would be biographys, keyword input in portfolio's etc. This would eliminate have to click and save every time you add a description/keyword etc. If this has been addressed recently in the update, my apologies.
-A
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n/er/g communications
Posts:24
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| 10/18/2007 2:49 AM |
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Hmmm. I think the idea of certification, while probably useful in other applications, may not be in the best interest of the jamuse cause.
IMHO, the moment you tag a user/company with "Jamuse approved" or something similar, you immediately create a perceived difference in the mind of the searcher. More often than not, this difference would equate to "Trusted" vs "Non-Trusted". And i fear this would happen regardless of whether or not they officially take the time to understand the differences.
Plus, i think implementing a structure like this throws jamuse back into the mainstream portfolio mix where sites have different levels of memberships for purchase.
Is there a specific need that has been discovered that would necessitate dividing users? Or was this just an on the fly brainstorm? |
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Director Fox
Posts:48
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| 10/18/2007 8:22 AM |
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This is turning into a very interesting conversation, but I'm afraid some people might be missing it because it's on the "new home page" thread. I'm starting a new thread called "User Certification/Jamuse Approved" Let's continue the brainstorming here:
http://www.jamuse.com/Discussions/tabid/54/forumid/5/postid/309/view/topic/Default.aspx
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_sobule design
Posts:41
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| 10/18/2007 9:35 AM |
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Good idea on moving this [hijacked] thread, Alex (Fox).
Hector in answer to your question regarding collaboration; here in Toronto there's a small, informal, and loosely formed group of creatives that all work independently however when bigger projects or RFPs come up people collaborate on the project as it would be too big in scope or breadth to take on as just a studio. So by 'bigger projects' I meant specifically client-initiated ones but now that you mention it, these could be any kind of project or cause.
So, not a fully-formed collective or anything like that, just an informal group of experienced professionals that form together to work with larger clients. I suppose at the end of the day there's no real delineation here between just hiring freelancers but the difference is that everybody has equal stakes in the project. Often times a freelancer or two will be brought in on top of this to support production during the *crunch*. Does that make sense? More like a trade-cartel less like a bunch of mercenaries.
This kind of approach is more common over the pond in Europe; I know of several more formalised groups over there...
Really this could all just fall under one job-posting– or rather help wanted–type area. Just a matter of phrasing one's advert appropriately.
I'll stop babbling now and get some work done.... |
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